“I grew up never having to fear and always being able to live with this confidence that all I need to do is speak the truth and good things will result, and I can count on it and so I can boldly approach other individuals and live with them in a way that is less anxious...” - Dr. Craig Uffman
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We covered a lot of ground with Dr. Derek Woodard-Lehman in our last episode of the podcast as he helped us consider why it's so difficult for some of us to have conversations about race and racism and whether or not racism is still a problem today. We also talked about colorblindness and how even though some people who say that they're colorblind might mean it from a place of good intent, it isn't yet a sufficient standard for us, and we discussed why that is. We also began to try to understand what is meant by the controversial phrase systemic racism, and we will be continuing that conversation today.
As a reminder, Dr. Woodard-Lehman teaches at Pittsburgh Theological Seminary, specializing in Christian Ethics. He is focused particularly on how Christian commitments have mobilized political resistance to racial injustice. We have been talking about situations on the podcast such as the American Civil Rights Movement, which is definitely one such instance of this having happened.
I hope that you will join us as we continue this conversation, discussing topics such as the also controversial phrase critical race theory and political commentator David French's take on it, lawyer Kimberlé Crenshaw's take on intersectionality, white privilege and what it means, the distinction between guilt and responsibility in terms of white privilege and how we share that responsibility, and so much more!
I owe Dr. Woodard-Lehman so much gratitude for once again giving us so much to think about. I hope that you will join us in our next episode as we begin to look deeply at whether or not our racial disparities actually exist and whether or not they are systemic. Thank you for listening, and be sure to invite your friends to listen in as well!
Questions for Clergy and Other Group Leaders
- What is generally referred to when scholars speak of ‘whiteness’ as a way of analyzing our racial tensions and conceiving of solutions?
- What is critical race theory?
- What is intersectionality?
- How is it helpful to distinguish between guilt and responsibility in talking together about our racial tensions.
Show Notes
[3:07] – Dr. Woodard-Lehman provides us with a reminder of the geological metaphor that he used in the last episode, comparing the formation of the Finger Lakes and the water that they supply to people to racism and inequity.
[6:10] – Dr. Woodard-Lehman adds that his metaphor applies to not only social problems of historical times but to social problems of today as well, even if such problems are not immediately visible to us.
[8:29] – People on both sides of this argument generally agree that there are statistical disparities.
[10:15] – Dr. Uffman recalls a conversation between Chris Wallace and Donald Trump about systemic racism and why Trump ended the racial sensitivity training that addresses white privilege.
[12:31] – Dr. Uffman switches gears to the executive order dictating that we are not allowed to teach the idea that the United States is inherently racist or sexist.
[15:42] – Dr. Woodard-Lehman defines critical race theory and what it entails.
[17:08] – Dr. Woodard-Lehman defines intersectionality – a central facet of critical race theory – and gives examples of it provided by lawyer Kimberlé Crenshaw.
[19:27] – Intersectionality is a tactic used to dismiss cases of discrimination based on one facet of a person's identity.
[22:38] – White privilege, as Dr. Woodard-Lehman expounds upon, has a broad spectrum of different meanings but does have an especially helpful and useful meaning.
[24:59] – White privilege oppresses not just Blacks but persons of color in general.
[25:29] – Dr. Woodard-Lehman provides us with an example of a time in college when something about him was wrongly assumed because of his race.
[28:16] – Dr. Uffman provides us with an example of a time in Times Square when he inadvertently benefitted from white privilege.
[31:03] – Dr. Uffman came to realize that white privilege, when it comes to how people are treated by police, is in part because of convict leasing in the south in the 1880s.
[32:42] – Dr. Woodard-Lehman emphasizes that experiences with law enforcement is one of the most important aspects of white privilege and provides further examples.
[35:45] – Dr. Uffman returns to the concept of inequity and racial sensitivity training.
[36:28] – One component of racial sensitivity training is sharing stories like Dr. Woodard-Lehman and Dr. Uffman have been doing and acknowledging white privilege as real.
[39:22] – An instructor crafting their syllabus with texts from white male scholars is not usually doing so out of ill intent.
[40:39] – Dr. Uffman reiterates how easy it is to see racial inequity and disparity as natural rather than socially constructed, something that he himself has done.
[43:02] – Dr. Woodard-Lehman stresses how white privilege can be blatant and obvious but can also be more subtle.
[45:57] – Dr. Uffman once again returns to Dr. Woodard-Lehman's water metaphor and emphasizes a distinction between guilt and responsibility.
[46:50] – Dr. Woodard-Lehman further explains the difference between guilt and responsibility and how we should be discussing responsibility rather than guilt.
[47:27] – Dr. Woodard-Lehman provides an example of responsibility over guilt coming into play when action needs to be taken to correct something that is wrong.
[50:10] – There are situations, such as in the example that Dr. Woodard-Lehman provides, when we must take responsibility for correcting wrongs even if we are not at fault.
[52:27] – Dr. Woodard-Lehman discusses our shared responsibility over social arrangements, responsibility that is ours even though we had little to no part in initially arranging them.
[53:45] – The difficulty that we have over having fruitful conversations about race and racism is partially because of how we wrestle with wondering who to blame.
[54:37] – Dr. Woodard-Lehman predicts what obstacles exist other than an inability to look past guilt.
[57:15] – Dr. Woodard-Lehman offers a potential explanation as to why some people might be inclined to disagree with antiracist ideology.
Links and Resources
Isabel Wilkerson – Caste: The Origins of Our Discontent
Ibram X. Kendi – How to Be an Antiracist
Connect with Dr. Craig Uffman:
